H-Teach Films and pedagogy (X H-ALBION)

Author: "Michael Childs" <mchilds@ubishops.ca>
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997

I tried it [A Man for All Seasons} this fall. I found that the main thing
my students got was that Thomas More was a great hero and very articulate in the final court scene; this seemed to distract them from larger cultural/social issues. However, this was in a Western Civ course (400-1600); part of the problem may have been how little time we spent on Ren England. hope this helps.

Susie L. Steinbach
Hamline University
History Department
slsteinb@piper.hamline.edu
(612) 641-2306

Author: Glenn Wilkinson, glenn.wilkinson@acadiau.ca
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997

I've delayed replying to this subject because I've not yet read the most recent issue of Perspectives (I imagine my colleagues are pouring over it), but I've always thought that film is a wonderful tool for teaching. This is especially true with students who are more and more visual in their learning. However, the point to continually remind them is that it is `just a film' - like a book, it is someone's opinion. And, perhaps more difficult (particularly for Western Civ students who might be in their first year), that a film says more about its own time than the period in question. The example I use (mostly because it was a hit when the question arose for me) is the film Platoon about the American experience in their war with Vietnam. It is a film that conveys much information - what it was like, etc, but it says much more about the 1980s than the 1960s. Some students find this hard to grasp - perhaps it is my technique! (Any suggestions here?)

Films for earlier periods that I found helpful were `Brother Sun, Sister Moon' about the story of St. Francis. Students seemed to find it helpful to see what Italian countryside looked like, the pomp of 13 th C culture. It was helpful, but it required careful introduction and discussion afterwards.

The main problem with film is that it takes up too much class time - perhaps even more than is allotted. Here at Acadia, we are initiating a `Film `n History' (`film and history', but also `filming history') evening which seems to have wide support. Films suggested were `classic' films that tell of the time they were made (both fictional and documentary) such as `Casablanca' and `Triumph of the Will' (both again requiring context), or films about the past, such as `Black Robe' or dramatizations of anything by Jane Austen. These evenings are meant to be fun - it is after all `free-time' for students (Thursday evening at 6:30 before they trundle off to the bar) - but informative, also. It has been pitched as watching films that everyone should know or have seen - I mentioned that students could work Eisenstein's `Battleship Potempkin' into the conversation next time they are at a party...

Does anyone have any suggestions as to films to show or handy sources? (I find the internet movie database the most convenient)

Glenn Wilkinson
Acadia University
glenn.wilkinson@acadiau.ca

Author: Michael Weaver, mwc67f@panam.edu
Date: Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997

Some of my colleagues and I have run a "History Movie Night" here at the University of Texas-Pan American for some years now. The primary emphasis is on entertainment since, as you say, the students are on their own time.

Among others, we have shown:

The Molly Maguires
Last of the Mohicans
Glory
Dr. Strangelove
Spartacus
The Lion in Winter
El Cid
Ran
Henry V (the Brannagh version)
Zoot Suit
Cabeza de Vaca
Paths of Glory
Mr. Smith Goes to Washington
Rikiyu
Salt of the Earth
All the King's Men
Nicholas and Alexandra
Quilombo
Kagemusha
The Lemon Grove Incident
Mountains of the Moon
Breaker Morant
Incident at Oglala
The Warlord
The Beast
Becket
The Mission
84 Charlie Mopic
Alexander Nevsky
The Crucible
All Quiet on the Western Front (1930 version)
The Grapes of Wrath
M (got an excellent discussion on this one in my modern Europe class the next day)
The Nasty Girl
The Advocate
The Good Earth
Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1956 version)
Yojimbo
Black and White in Color

I look forward to seeing everyone else's recommendations. We always have trouble thinking of films for the first half of U.S. history.

One tip: for harder-to-find films (especially foreign films), we often turn to The Video Library of Philadelphia, PA. They run a mail-order _rental_ store that has an excellent selection of foreign films. You get to keep the film three days after it arrives, and it runs about $10, including shipping both ways. They will send you a catalogue of their collection. Their number is 1-800-669-7157.

Michael Weaver
Department of History and Philosophy
University of Texas-Pan American
mwc67f@panam.edu

Author: Julie E. Smith
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997

The problem that has been pointed out about using film is making sure that students do not take it as fact. I have found that one of the best ways to do this is through discussion. Instead of "A Man for All Seasons", last semster I used Kenneth Brannagh's "Much Ado About Nothing" a few clips-- to aid a discussion of the Renaissance ideals of the courtier, in addition to some primary written sources, including Castiglione. This has been the most profitable way to use film that I have found.

I haven't seen anyone mention the Crusades series put out by A&E. The production is actually a good one and fits nicely into a 50 minute time slot (at least one episode does). Students find them humorous and still get the point.

Other films that I have found useful have been selections of "Monty Python's The Quest for the Holy Grail", "Romeo Juliet", "Henry V"-- for the battle scenes, and "The Seventh Seal".

Without starting the heated debate over "Braveheart" again, I was wondering if anyone ahs had any luck using specific scenes from it. I understand there are some about drawing and quartering in particular.

Julie E. Smith
Univesity of ARkansas

Author: Sharon D. Michalove, mlove@uiuc.edu
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997

I have always thought that one useful way to use film is when talking about
varying interpretations of some historical event, personage, etc. What I had in mind would be to have students view both Olivier and Branagh as Henry V and discuss not only the historical Henry V but how Olivier and Branagh represented or challenged the outlook of their own time in the films. Of course, looking at Olivier and Ian McKellan as Richard III could
also be an interesting exercise.

Sincerely,

Sharon D. Michalove
Assistant to the Chair (Undergraduate Studies),
Dept. of History, UIUC
309 Gregory Hall,
810 South Wright Street, Urbana, IL 61801
217-333-4145
mlove@uiuc.edu
http://www.history.uiuc.edu/fac_dir/mlove.html

Author: Jean-Jacques Rousseau (1712-1778)
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997

There's a book by Mark Carnes called Past Imperfect, which has essays by all sorts of leading historians on the accuracy of films in their time period. It has people like Stephen Ambrose on The Longest Day, Stephen Jay
Gould on Jurassic Park, and a rather amusing account of Patton by Paul Fussell. There is a rather unsympathetic review of A Man for all Seasons by Richard Marius

Author: Michael Childs, mchilds@ubishops.ca
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997

Nothing particularly deep, but rather just a few comments on the film and history discussion:

1. The best thing in "Braveheart" - possibly the only good thing - is the scene of the charge of heavy cavalry, which, due to camera angles and slow build up to the climax, gives an convincing idea of what it might have been like to face a charge of armored knights, and how frightening it must have been to foot soldiers if a Mel Gibson wasn't on hand to supply the appropriate response. But even here ( I believe) events at the Battle of Falkirk are transposed to Stirling.
2. The most intelligent historical film I've seen is "Black Robe": whether or not it is accurate in all its details can be doubted, but it certainly attempts to portray people of the time in their own terms, and to observe cultural contact in a way which makes plain that the 17th C Jesuits' world view was just as strange to us as that of the Algonkians'. Watching it in tandem with "Dances with Wolves" will underline this point, and emphasize the difference between an historical approach and Hollywood's more Manichaen view of the past.
3. I would also recommend "Past Imperfect" as a source: since most contributors agree that these films need to be put into context, the short and often amusing treatments of the film to be shown would be a good way to achieve this. The standards vary, but most of the chapters try to set both the film's subject matter and the film itself in their own time, thus working on the problem of representation and interpretation from two different angles. The treatment of the various remakes of "Mutiny on the Bounty" are a model of this approach.

Michael Childs
Department of History
Bishop's University
Lennoxville QC Canada
J1M 1Z7
(819) 822-9600, ext. 2388
mchilds@ubishops.ca

Author: NELSONP@uwplatt.edu
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 1997

The film MARY SILLIMAN'S WAR is an excellent depiction of the Revolutionary
era. It was not a feature film, in the sense of full national release to movie
theaters, but it was shown on cable and the AHA included a session about it a
year or two ago. It was made by Heritage Films, Steven Schechter, producer.
It is available for purchase.

Paula Nelson
University of Wisconsin-Platteville

(I am working with Steven Schecter on a Great Plains documentary, nearing completion.)
Bob Wheeler
Co-editor